Let's Talk Squash - SUSPENDED

JC009 · Newbie Joined: 16 Jul 2007 Posts: 8

Is anyone else as astounded as I am in the achievements of this young player. He has just beaten a top 20 player to take out a PSA final and he is still only ?17.

Didn't he take James Willstrop to 5 last year as well?

How does this compare to the rise of Ramy Ashour? It would seem to be to be going along the same precedent.

I have never seen him play, but wouyld be interested in knowing his style of game. Is it trick shots etc ot more a game of attrition?

nick_andrea · Contributor Joined: 17 Aug 2007 Posts: 14

hahaha Aamir Atlas has 22 or 23 years old i asked some one from Pakistan but i can't say his name, i know he is too short but too old.
Anyway when he beat this guy he beat them in pakistan and u know the refree will be against player like Azlan and Ong.

Run-away-from-danger Boy · Prolific Contributor Joined: 29 Jun 2007 Posts: 140

Strong statement, Mr. Andrea. Are you suggesting that the Pakistani referees 'favor' (rather than using the word 'cheat') their local players? And what proof - other than hearsay - do you have to claim that Aamir Atlas Khan is not 17 years old as reported?

It is not at all surprising that local players perform a lot better on their home soil - that's what 'home court advantage' is all about. Anyway, the lad is ranked in the top 30 so he can't all that bad regardless of the accusations you a spitting out.

drop.shot · Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 8:41 pm Post subject:

Andrea partially is right about one thing at least - age of Aamir Atlas Khan... I have heard this story too many times to let it go without my two cents. He looks "older than he states he is". Let us put it this way.

P.S. I doubt if he has defeated James Willstrop at any stage though Twisted Evil

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Run-away-from-danger Boy · Prolific Contributor Joined: 29 Jun 2007 Posts: 140

Actually, let me eat my words. I just looked him up on the PSA website in regards to his history and rankings. His birthday is July 30 so according to that, he just turned 17.

In April of 2005 - he would have 14 years old - he was already ranked 86 in the world. Now, far be it for me to call anyone a liar, but that just seems a little too unbelievable for me. I cannot imagine a 14 year old ranked so highly. It also tells me that he would have joined the tour aged 13 which also sounds ridiculous. What's more, he's listed at 150cm tall - which is 4'11" - which simply adds fuel to the fire that it aint quite right. (Unless that stat is the original information he provided when he first entered the ranking as a 13 year old and the PSA hasn't updated it. Surely he cannot be so short?) It says he turned pro in 2002 - aged 12. (??!!!??)

No doubt he is a fine player, but the information provided here smells a little fishy....

seshadri · Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 5:23 am Post subject:

Regarding Aamir's age, only a wrist xray can confirm the accuracy or otherwise of his stated age. Regarding his skills, there is no doubt. I saw him play in India in 2005, and he took a game off Ramy Ashour . His game is more of the retrieving type rather than spectacular racquet play [unless he has changed in the last 2 years]. He is very short [around 5 feet, give or take a few inches] and mentally very tough. He looks to be Pakistan's best bet for a player in the Top 10, though it's probably a couple of years down the road. I don't buy the line about his recent results being a result of friendly refereeing.
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nick_andrea · Contributor Joined: 17 Aug 2007 Posts: 14

No way man i can't believe that Jahangir won the world open and he had just 16 years old.
Jahangir and Janshir are not a good squash player.

HACKER · Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 12:01 pm Post subject:

I have it from a very reliable source that he is definitely not a junior and suggestions put his age at between 20 and 22. Unfortunately we will have no way of actually finding out so have to take his word for it!

Maybe some of the Brits should knock a couple of years of their age and see how they like it.

Calsquasher · Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 4:30 am Post subject:

Who cares how old he is, its the results that count. I can see absolutely nothing he has to gain from lying about his age. I am glad to see a Pakistani in the win column again even though it was in Pakistan with very few European players.
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gmandleydixon · Newbie Joined: 23 Jul 2007 Posts: 8

There seems to be a widely held unsubstantiated belief (often by people within the game who ought to know better) that many of the Pakistani players are over age. I do not go along with this. Aamir certainly does not not look any older than his age to me, and suggestions that he looks 20-22 are very wide of the mark. Are we really suggesting that he looks older than Omar Mossad, Ramy, Tom Richards and Joe Lee? The same accusations were levelled at Jahangir and Sohail Qasir without any evidence. I played them both in !976 and they were 12/13 at the time and looked it, and there claimed ages when they were playing fitted with what I knew.

It is about time we stopped whingeing until we have clear evidence. It is unedifying to make this accusations and we should remain above it.

We should be welcoming Aamir into the fold. He is a well mannered boy who plays the game in the right spirit and he is potentially a great player. I hope that he succeeds and that he is the first of the next generation of great Pakistani players

Marro · Prolific Contributor Joined: 04 Jul 2007 Posts: 77

Hear hear gmandleydixon

Boody · Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:46 am Post subject:

i agree but i wish there were any videos of him online that way we can judge his play
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squashed · Newbie Joined: 13 Jul 2007 Posts: 9

there is evidence...one example- i overheard one player noting that a well known indian girl's age had decreased every year for the last 3 years, saying that 'indian girl' was once 3 years older than herself and now as of this girls latest passport 'indian girl' is only one month older.
the problem is that a lot of the birth certificates arent issued or monitored as well as they are in other countries, so therefore new, not quite as accurate, passports are easier to obtain... Hisham Khan even admitted that he wasnt 100% sure on how old he was and even changed his birth year at one point, and thats documented in Squash mag.
another eg. at a very large asian junior tournament players from pakistan were turning in passports with whiteout on their birthdates and that is not a joke. age cheating does go on, you cannot deny it, there's no smoke without some fire.
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seshadri · Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 11:32 am Post subject:

You cannot compare Hashim Khan's times to the present. Birth certificates can be faked, wrist xrays can't. It does not cost a great deal to find out if a player is faking his age
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bendi36 · Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 11:57 am Post subject:

wrist x rays hav nothing to do with age Laughing

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Marro · Prolific Contributor Joined: 04 Jul 2007 Posts: 77

It seems some xrays do.

"X-rays are accurate only to within plus or minus two years in assessing age, so could not distinguish with certainty between a 16 and a 20-year-old, particularly from racial groups for which the UK holds no official data on size and age"

from this Guardian article relating to asylum seekers.

seshadri · Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 12:31 pm Post subject:

Combining wrist xray measurements with dental records should narrow the age range to within 1 year. How much more accuracy is needed?
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bendi36 · Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 1:09 pm Post subject:

no. you were saying that x rays reveal age. i no you hav a growth plate their but seriously some ppl peak early or late and there is no way u can determine how long a person has been alive for. you can certainly get close but no way to definitely one hundred percent without a doubt say this person is 16.
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Marro · Prolific Contributor Joined: 04 Jul 2007 Posts: 77

Of course, x-rays are dangerous and should only be used for medically beneficial needs in general. Do you think all junior competitors and their parents would be happy if they were checked by x-ray and dental examinations? I doubt it somehow.

bendi36 · Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 2:46 pm Post subject:

X raying isnt dangerous LMAO excessive X raying yes. it'd be alot more dangerous going out into the sun for half an hr with no sunscreen.
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seshadri · Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 2:49 pm Post subject:

You can't have it both ways. If you strongly suspect that somebody is lying about his age, you can't then say that I will not give him a chance to prove his age[+/- 1 year] by wrist xrays because xrays are harmful. Either you accept a person's age is what his documents state, or give the person a chance to defend himself against innuendo by submitting himself to xray or MRI investigations. The damage to his honour is far more painful tha any damage that a few wrist xrays will cause.
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Marro · Prolific Contributor Joined: 04 Jul 2007 Posts: 77

seshadri · Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 3:35 pm Post subject:

Ok, Marro. I accept your position that you do not question Aamir's stated age.
Of course xrays are harmful. However, when you weigh the potential harm that an xray can cause against the certain harm that vicious innuendo inflicts, I'm sure any honourable person will take his chances with the xray,to shut up everyone once and for all
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gmandleydixon · Newbie Joined: 23 Jul 2007 Posts: 8

For those you who still thinks Aamir is 20-22 have a look at this picture of him in 2003
http://www.squashpics.com/bjo2003/BJO02.jpg

There is absolutely no evidence that Aamir is over age. If someone would like to offer any evidence to the contrary then declare it; otherwise forget it. It sounds very much like sour grapes to me. The truth can be seen at
http://www.squashsite.co.uk/aamir.htm

Khalid · Contributor Joined: 27 Aug 2007 Posts: 17 Location: Kuwait

Well, in terms of age misrepresentation, I have always heard that Pakistani players are always older than they state. The funny thing is, I've only heard that from other Pakistani players that have trained with these "stars" at an earlier stage of their careers. There are many reasons why these sources could be merely bad-mouthing players like Amir...jealousy for the most part, but hearing the same accusation over and over again have made me a little suspicious. I always though Aamir was older than he states, but his Junior British Open picture posted earlier totally threw me off! I dont really care about his age, as being on the PSA tour has got nothing to do with age, but in many national - level tournaments, it could be beneficiary to "mend" his birth certifications to show him at a younger age...It is a sad truth that his can be very easily done in most 3rd world countries. There is so much pressure on squash in pakistan as a means of attaining fortune and fame, to a point where it has become so corrupted and controlled by certain individuals. There are some names that keep coming up in most Pakistan-squash conversations repeatedly and it is a shame, as they are prominent names in world of squash.

In many ways, I do not see why there is so much pressure on Pakistan as a country to produce players...The fact that the Great Jahanghir and Jansher (ok...as well Hashim Khan, Roshan, Torsam, Qamar, Salim....come to think of it, it is quite a list) were great players only worked out at a time when commercialization was not a major part of the sport...exposure was the main concern, not sponsorship money and media coverage. For that time, Pakistani players could provide that "exotic" flare to squash....Now, as the money and fame have come into the game, the conditions in Pakistan (Ecomonic/political/social) cannot accommodate such requirements without being corrupted or controlled. I believe that the current ecomnomic/social conditions in Pakistan will not allow a single pakistani player to achieve world greatness, or even reaching a top 5 position in the world rankings. So with that comment goes my best wishes for success to the fathers of modern squash, and hope that the corruption can be put aside for the benefit of the game. I apoplogize for any misconceptions I have, but this is merely the impression I get from observing Pakistani pros, coaches and administrators.
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